1. American State Boundaries
    Which state shares the longest border with another state? (The border does not have to be continuous.) Which state shares the shortest?
    Apr 16, 2003 @ 13:50 - Craig ("Craig" <trehala@...>)
  2. Re: [BoundaryPoint] American State Boundaries
    On Wednesday 16 April 2003 09:50 am, you wrote: The shortest is easy - at AZ-CO-NM-UT there are two pairs of states that meet at a point. BJB ... -- Brian J.
    Apr 16, 2003 @ 14:15 - Brian J. Butler (Brian J. Butler <bjbutler@...>)
  3. Re: American State Boundaries
    nice question & nice answer how about canv for longest ... states that meet ... (The border ... shortest? ... http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
    Apr 16, 2003 @ 15:19 - acroorca2002 ("acroorca2002" <orc@...>)
  4. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    CA-NV looks like the quickest answer, but I think OK-TX might be longer because of the meanders in the Red River combined with the straight-line boundary
    Apr 16, 2003 @ 15:57 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  5. RE: [BoundaryPoint] American State Boundaries
    A good candidate for longest is OK-TX ... From: Craig [mailto:trehala@yahoo.com] Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2003 7:50 AM To: BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com
    Apr 16, 2003 @ 15:54 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  6. Re: American State Boundaries
    ... for sure in fact whenever sinuosities of streams or coasts are involved you may inflate the claim to infinity with some good reason ... (The border ...
    Apr 16, 2003 @ 16:08 - acroorca2002 ("acroorca2002" <orc@...>)
  7. Re: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    On Wednesday 16 April 2003 11:19 am, you wrote: CANV is certainly the straight-line champ. If we go fractal maybe ID-MT, OK-TX, or even VA-WV would take the
    Apr 16, 2003 @ 15:38 - Brian J. Butler (Brian J. Butler <bjbutler@...>)
  8. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    But CA-NV wouldn t be the longest border between two states, straight or not. The OK-TX border for a good distance is the meandering Red River. There s no
    Apr 16, 2003 @ 17:18 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  9. Re: American State Boundaries
    Thank-you for your answer, Brian, however I am looking for a state border that does not meet at a point. Think of Turkey-Azerbaijan or Western Sahara-Algeria:
    Apr 16, 2003 @ 17:24 - Craig ("Craig" <trehala@...>)
  10. Re: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    On Wednesday 16 April 2003 01:18 pm, you wrote: A natural boundary, such as a river, has a length that depends on how closely you measure it. BJB ... -- Brian
    Apr 16, 2003 @ 18:11 - Brian J. Butler (Brian J. Butler <bjbutler@...>)
  11. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    Well, *anything* has a length depending on how you measure it. But most US state boundaries have specific definitions that are actual places on the ground,
    Apr 16, 2003 @ 21:12 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  12. Re: American State Boundaries
    among american interstate boundaries excluding or ignoring azco & nmut i think depa must be the shortest & moreover it cant be fractally inflated since it is
    Apr 16, 2003 @ 21:33 - acroorca2002 ("acroorca2002" <orc@...>)
  13. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    I disagree completely. There is no measuring around an infinite number of grains of sand or molecules involved in measure the OK-TX boundary. If it is the
    Apr 16, 2003 @ 21:58 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  14. Re: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    On Wednesday 16 April 2003 05:12 pm, you wrote: You are not on the right wavelength yet. The natural boundaries you enumerated are not smooth curves that can
    Apr 16, 2003 @ 21:44 - Brian J. Butler (Brian J. Butler <bjbutler@...>)
  15. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    The center of a river is about as smooth as you can get. Why would you measure a boundary line around a grain of sand? Theoretically, this discussion could get
    Apr 16, 2003 @ 22:20 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  16. Re: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    On Wednesday 16 April 2003 06:20 pm, you wrote: Why would the center of a river be any smoother than banks from which it is equidistant? And molecules, grains
    Apr 16, 2003 @ 22:26 - Brian J. Butler (Brian J. Butler <bjbutler@...>)
  17. Re: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    The riverbanks can have an almost infinite length which is practically impossible to measure, but I think the center or thalweg can not be considered in the
    Apr 16, 2003 @ 23:12 - Michael Kaufman (Michael Kaufman <mikekaufman79@...>)
  18. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    Because it is water. If you go down to the riverbed, you will have some variable elevations, but that doesn t mean you don t measure the distances above them.
    Apr 17, 2003 @ 00:02 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  19. Re: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    On Wednesday 16 April 2003 07:12 pm, you wrote: The thalweg is also of indefinite length because there can be an infinite number of changes in the y value over
    Apr 16, 2003 @ 23:52 - Brian J. Butler (Brian J. Butler <bjbutler@...>)
  20. Re: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    On Wednesday 16 April 2003 05:58 pm, you wrote: Actually, it is illigitimate to say that a river goes on for 15 miles, or that a river goes on for 1000 miles.
    Apr 16, 2003 @ 23:49 - Brian J. Butler (Brian J. Butler <bjbutler@...>)
  21. Re: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    On Wednesday 16 April 2003 08:02 pm, you wrote: 1. Regarding the first paragraph, I was not talking about elevations. 2. Your second paragraph is
    Apr 17, 2003 @ 00:16 - Brian J. Butler (Brian J. Butler <bjbutler@...>)
  22. Re: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    hmmm - I m not a math expert by any means, but I thought there would be some sort of convergence here...the midline has to lie somewhere, and it is possible
    Apr 17, 2003 @ 00:36 - Michael Kaufman (Michael Kaufman <mikekaufman79@...>)
  23. Re: American State Boundaries
    & besides that the thalweg itself is constantly shifting about & rolling along & in the real world doesnt hold still long enough to be measured but even that
    Apr 17, 2003 @ 00:49 - acroorca2002 ("acroorca2002" <orc@...>)
  24. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    This is simply paralysis of theory. Of course natural boundaries can be measured with relatively precise accuracy. One would not need to measure and include
    Apr 17, 2003 @ 05:53 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  25. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    1. But the boundary is. You may not be talking about elevations, but if the boundary is the middle of the river, that s where it is. 2. Even if you had to
    Apr 17, 2003 @ 06:00 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  26. Re: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    On Wednesday 16 April 2003 08:36 pm, you wrote: Suppose one bank is a perfectly straight line and the other is infinitely ragged. The midline would be half as
    Apr 17, 2003 @ 10:26 - Brian J. Butler (Brian J. Butler <bjbutler@...>)
  27. Re: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    On Thursday 17 April 2003 02:00 am, you wrote: I don t believe you are really thinking about the problem. But enough said. BJB ... -- Brian J. Butler BJB
    Apr 17, 2003 @ 10:30 - Brian J. Butler (Brian J. Butler <bjbutler@...>)
  28. Re: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    On Thursday 17 April 2003 01:53 am, you wrote: You are welcome to change the problem and answer it in any way you wish. Good luck. BJB ... -- Brian J. Butler
    Apr 17, 2003 @ 10:29 - Brian J. Butler (Brian J. Butler <bjbutler@...>)
  29. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    Thanks. I would then not have a problem, and be able to come up with the length. ... From: Brian J. Butler [mailto:bjbutler@bjbsoftware.com] Sent: Thursday,
    Apr 17, 2003 @ 16:39 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  30. Re: American State Boundaries
    ahh craig it just dawned on me & your question proves to have been even more brilliant than was previously believed & no wonder you expressed no satisfaction
    May 04, 2003 @ 20:54 - acroorca2002 ("acroorca2002" <orc@...>)
  31. Re: American State Boundaries
    ... That wouldn t come into play as an aswer to the question about interstate boundaries, because the part of Ellis Island that is federal would make it the
    May 07, 2003 @ 02:15 - L. A. Nadybal ("L. A. Nadybal" <lnadybal@...>)
  32. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    Ellis Island, while owned by the federal government, is not federal territory with a boundary to be established. The 3-acre +/- original island is NY and the
    May 07, 2003 @ 02:47 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  33. Re: American State Boundaries
    How does your reply square with what CNN wrote in its report on the Supreme Court case from the end of May 03 where it stated: As a result, most of the island
    May 07, 2003 @ 12:32 - L. A. Nadybal ("L. A. Nadybal" <lnadybal@...>)
  34. Re: American State Boundaries
    kevin is right & there is no longer any njny dispute here so far as i know nor anything to square with anything so far as i can see but apparently just the
    May 07, 2003 @ 13:52 - acroorca2002 ("acroorca2002" <orc@...>)
  35. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    Note that I wrote the original island which was +/- 3 ac in size. The 1834 NY-NJ compact gave NY jurisdiction over land above the low water level, while NJ
    May 07, 2003 @ 19:08 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  36. Re: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    On Wednesday 07 May 2003 03:08 pm, you wrote: I thought someone mentioned that this boundary was now defined by a set of marked corners. If so, I agree that
    May 07, 2003 @ 19:50 - Brian J. Butler (Brian J. Butler <bjbutler@...>)
  37. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    Yes. someone posted an article from a NJ GIS newsletter and it included a map from the pleadings that showed the NY jurisdictional boundary... it follows the
    May 07, 2003 @ 20:57 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  38. Re: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    On Wednesday 07 May 2003 04:57 pm, you wrote: So, does the boundary conform to a set of defined corners with stright line segments between them or to the high
    May 07, 2003 @ 21:29 - Brian J. Butler (Brian J. Butler <bjbutler@...>)
  39. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    See this for the process that was used: http://www.state.nj.us/dep/gis/gisupdate/up1499.pdf The article was not satisfactory in addressing my ultimate
    May 07, 2003 @ 22:41 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  40. Re: American State Boundaries
    yes the process has been clear since message 9922 the only thing we dont have yet is any confirmation of the congressional ratification of the final njny
    May 08, 2003 @ 00:51 - acroorca2002 ("acroorca2002" <orc@...>)
  41. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    Please let s not have the how many angels can dance on the head of htis pin discussion again. We can and do measure natural borders, and we don t need an
    May 08, 2003 @ 06:07 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  42. Re: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    Is the border marked anywhere on the island? If so, it might be worth a trip the next time I m in New York to get the photo. Asher ...
    May 08, 2003 @ 05:52 - Asher Samuels (Asher Samuels <asher972@...>)
  43. Re: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    On Thursday 08 May 2003 02:07 am, you wrote: I seriously doubt that anyone has attempted to measure the length of the Ellis Island boundary. Why would they?
    May 08, 2003 @ 10:30 - Brian J. Butler (Brian J. Butler <bjbutler@...>)
  44. Re: American State Boundaries
    ... length of the ... marking its position ... right brian but that is precisely my try & how about academic & esthetic value too for at stake here is nothing
    May 08, 2003 @ 15:12 - acroorca2002 ("acroorca2002" <orc@...>)
  45. Re: American State Boundaries
    yes this was the intention as of the 1998 materials we just saw but it might be worth a trip in any case just to find out if the work has been done yet & in
    May 08, 2003 @ 15:45 - acroorca2002 ("acroorca2002" <orc@...>)
  46. Re: American State Boundaries
    ... really you mean 1834 but can you help me to it thats the number i want or close enough to it ... be ... yes i agree if infinity doesnt equal infinity but
    May 08, 2003 @ 16:05 - acroorca2002 ("acroorca2002" <orc@...>)
  47. Re: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    On Thursday 08 May 2003 11:12 am, you wrote: I agree with you Mike and I too am interested in the academic (and aesthetic) fractal boundary question. I was
    May 08, 2003 @ 15:45 - Brian J. Butler (Brian J. Butler <bjbutler@...>)
  48. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    Would I agree? Obviously not. You can argue and theorize about the need to measure around molecules, but the real world doesn t operate that way. We can and do
    May 08, 2003 @ 17:17 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  49. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    ... From: acroorca2002 [mailto:orc@orcoast.com] Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 10:06 AM To: BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com Subject: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American
    May 08, 2003 @ 17:23 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  50. Re: American State Boundaries
    ... right & i never implied it was you were talking about shorelines tho & shoreline boundaries in particular or so i thought & so i was responding to that i
    May 08, 2003 @ 20:00 - acroorca2002 ("acroorca2002" <orc@...>)
  51. Re: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    On Thursday 08 May 2003 01:17 pm, you wrote: I wish you would read Chapter 5 of The Fractal Geometry of Nature by Benoit M. Mandelbrot, the title of which is
    May 08, 2003 @ 19:44 - Brian J. Butler (Brian J. Butler <bjbutler@...>)
  52. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    Believe me, I am not ignorant of the point on the other side of the argument. But human scale is reasonable when asking the question What is the longest
    May 08, 2003 @ 21:04 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  53. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    ... From: acroorca2002 [mailto:orc@orcoast.com] Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 2:01 PM To: BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com Subject: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American
    May 08, 2003 @ 21:56 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  54. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    What is bus&ss?
    May 08, 2003 @ 21:58 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  55. Re: American State Boundaries
    ... i promised to quit but this is too much fun ... much that ... yes our try pointing pursuits really arent oriented to the real world or what passes for the
    May 08, 2003 @ 20:45 - acroorca2002 ("acroorca2002" <orc@...>)
  56. Re: American State Boundaries
    hahaha see there you go again kevin imagining you are talking about reality & even pretending to walk the right high water line of the red river all the way
    May 08, 2003 @ 23:27 - acroorca2002 ("acroorca2002" <orc@...>)
  57. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    ... From: acroorca2002 [mailto:orc@orcoast.com] Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 2:46 PM To: BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com Subject: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American
    May 09, 2003 @ 00:22 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  58. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    It is not difficult at all; just time-consuming. I am sorry you fail to acknowledge this. Sarcasm aside, given the right parameters, it most certainly could be
    May 09, 2003 @ 00:25 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  59. Re: American State Boundaries
    better silly than sorry kevin & without sarcasm but earnestly for we are a real try pointing society here & not just a bunch of regular yakkers i believe the
    May 09, 2003 @ 04:29 - acroorca2002 ("acroorca2002" <orc@...>)
  60. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    Iam neither silly nor sorry. No walking on water either. I think you know the task could be done and of course OK-TX could be measured quite satisfactorily and
    May 09, 2003 @ 05:03 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  61. Re: American State Boundaries
    kevin ... ahh ok well try pointing has been our express center of gravity here & my thinking & comments are accordingly deliberately on point & always as
    May 09, 2003 @ 06:02 - acroorca2002 ("acroorca2002" <orc@...>)
  62. new njny
    kevin much intertwingling again below ... to ... the ... indeed you are definitely right & i omitted something important from the good book p79 as follows btw
    May 09, 2003 @ 15:19 - acroorca2002 ("acroorca2002" <orc@...>)
  63. RE: [BoundaryPoint] Re: American State Boundaries
    My comments were not off topic given the thread. I didn t begin it; I only commented on an ongoing thread. The quesiton originally was what is the longest
    May 09, 2003 @ 17:18 - Flynn, Kevin ("Flynn, Kevin" <flynnk@...>)
  64. Re: American State Boundaries
    ... i didnt say or imply they were offtopic just substantially offpoint a significant distinction traditionally here at bp since the very name of our game is
    May 09, 2003 @ 20:05 - acroorca2002 ("acroorca2002" <orc@...>)