--- In
BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com, "Lowell G. McManus"
<mcmanus71496@m...> wrote:
> Mike,
>
> Even though the Convention on the Contiguous Zone, etc. was
intended for
> international boundaries, it has been officially anointed by the
Supremes as
> their guiding principles for the interpretation of internal US
boundaries.
> Therefore, I think that it would probably govern this situation. I
have not
> searched out the historic origins of the respective PR and VI
claims; but if
> they descend from respective Spanish and Danish claims from prior
to American
> acquisition of these dependencies, then the international standard
would be
> quite appropriate. Can you elucidate us on the origins of the
claims? Is the
> Submerged Lands Act involved here?
cant definitely answer either question
tho i think the sla might be adduced
sort of the way you would like to adduce the convention on the
contiguous zone etc
& i think there is some probability of both of these legal
applications actually occurring
yours only if push ever came to shove & there was a legal test tho
but first
& in the normal course of amicable relations
i would think an sla type of unequal regime is actually fully in
effect for both pr at 9nm & vi at 3nm
which i am assuming
since i am unaware of any difficulty or other anomaly here
& i have long been curious myself about the 9nm of pr waters
supposing its cause was the same hispanic heritage as caused the
texas & florida 9nm waters
but of course the cases of california & guam etc very probably bust
that thesis
& i think the 3nm of virgin islands waters probably owe less to their
danish heritage than to a law of the usa
& perhaps it is an appendage of the sla
but i have no idea really
for i have never actually seen but only surmised this law
providing 3nm to all american territories except pr
for i have seen 3nm waters so attributed
not only to vi but to every other territorial entity of the usa
except pr
in some fairly credible sources
but you know i have just been sniffing all these realities out
without hardly any actual legal accessibility til now
& i certainly do wish you can pinpoint them one way or the other
especially since not just the locations but the very existence of 2
such important & exotic multipoints depend on it
tho i cant promise you your doing so would be productive in the eyes
of anyone but me
& thanx for relaxing your certainty here into something a little more
tentative
i think it is appropriate both in this case & in general
> Because I wrote my message on PRVI without a good map of the
region, I obviously
> didn't realize that the VI 3nm limit would not reach a median
line. While that
> does make it a bit complicated, I think that in such a situation
the median line
> should still stand as an absolute limit for the jurisdiction with
the wider
> waters. To do otherwise (by allowing wrap-around or any sort of
> proportionality) would forever preclude the jurisdiction with the
narrower claim
> from ever exercising a claim as wide as the other.
>
> My tentative scheme would indeed interpose a band of federal waters
between the
> median line and the VI 3nm arc. It is tentative, and it could be
wrong.
>
> Lowell G. McManus
> Leesville, Louisiana, USA
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <orc@o...>
> To: <BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2003 11:12 AM
> Subject: [BoundaryPoint] Re: PRVI
>
>
> --- In BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com, "Lowell G. McManus"
> <mcmanus71496@m...> wrote:
> > Earlier, in another context, Mike wrote:
> >
> > > & the problems of prusvin & prusvis are largely confined to
> figuring
> > > out how to balance the effects of the 9nm regime of puerto rico
> with
> > > those of the 3nm regime of the virgin islands
> >
> > > probably by first giving the 3nm full effect
> > > & then wrapping the 9nm around it as much as possible
> >
> > > tho i could imagine giving them a proportional effect too
> > > &or even cutting a clean meridional division between them
> > > or some other solution
> >
> > > but i assume this remains undone & so is only putative in any
case
> > > & therefore maybe not so pressing or problematic as the others
> >
> > I, also, assume that this remains undone, but I can tell you
> exactly how it
> > would be done.
>
> yes i think this is exactly how it would be done if pr & vi were
> independent countries
> but this is an internal boundary within the united states
> where the rules often differ
>
> also
> the best maps i have seen indicate that the median line would fall
> well outside the 3nm arcs of the virgin islands yet well within the
> 9nm arcs of puerto rico
>
> so it seems to me your methodology would actually disconnect the
> territorial waters of pr from those of vi & interpose a band of
> federal waters between them
> & incidentally preclude the existence of any prusvi tripoints
>
> & what you are proposing might seem particularly unfair & unamerican
> to pr
> in giving full effect to vi while needlessly foreshortening pr
> owing not to any american law
>
> so i am still expecting
> full effect for vi first
> followed by full effect for pr all the way to the vi limit
> rather than only as far as the median line
> & thus 2 wraparound tripoints at the northeasternmost &
> southeasternmost extremities of pr waters
> where they are only slightly eclipsed by those of vi
> but i am glad to have your opinion
>
> >
> > The first paragraph of Article 12 of the Convention on the
> Territorial Sea and
> > Contiguous Zone says:
> > _______________________
> >
> > Where the coasts of two States are opposite or adjacent to each
> other, neither
> > of the two States is entitled, failing agreement between them to
> the contrary,
> > to extend its territorial sea beyond the median line every point
of
> which is
> > equidistant from the nearest points on the baselines from which
the
> breadth of
> > the territorial seas of each of the two States is measured.
> > _______________________
> >
> > So, there would first be drawn a median line between the two
closest
> > Puertorriqueño and Virgin islands. Then the respective 9nm and
3nm
> limits would
> > extend outward against, but in no wise beyond, the median line.
> The median line
> > would squarely whack off the arc of each, the wider arc of Puerto
> Rico much more
> > bluntly so.
> >
> > The points PRUSVIN and PRUSVIS would be located where the Virgin
> 3nm arc
> > encounters the median line.
> >
> > Lowell G. McManus
> > Leesville, Louisiana, USA
>
>
>
>
>
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