Subject: my vatican credo so far<br/>
Date: Apr 14, 2004 @ 20:59<br/>
Author: m donner (&quot;m donner&quot; &lt;maxivan82@...&gt;)<br/>
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<div id="ygrps-yiv-445123650">first thanxxx to all who inspired & contributed to this detailed <br/>
investigation<br/>
which has certainly already occasioned one of our richest beepy hours yet<br/>
<br/>
& based on everything i have seen so far<br/>
following is what i now believe to be the best available if not yet the <br/>
absolute truth about itva around the colonnades<br/>
<br/>
first<br/>
i believe the vatican is right in maintaining that itva is actually marked <br/>
by a travertine strip<br/>
& i believe the actual delineation this most probably refers to is the outer <br/>
edge of the outermost of the several concentric travertine strips that curve <br/>
between the colonnade arms<br/>
& i also believe this is the same strip edge marked black in the first of <br/>
the graphic overlay pix<br/>
<a rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://www.globalgeografia.com/europa/vaticano/fig03a.jpg">http://www.globalgeografia.com/europa/vaticano/fig03a.jpg</a><br/>
<br/>
& i believe all this<br/>
even tho i believe the vatican is wrong in maintaining elsewhere in the same <br/>
pronouncement that itva is marked by the leonine walls<br/>
& even tho i also believe the second overlay pic from the same source is <br/>
also most likely wrong in showing itva dividing the propylaea<br/>
<a rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://www.globalgeografia.com/europa/vaticano/fig03b.jpg">http://www.globalgeografia.com/europa/vaticano/fig03b.jpg</a><br/>
<br/>
<br/>
for<br/>
secondly<br/>
i believe the vatican is also right in showing on its official website map<br/>
<a rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://tinyurl.com/3gjob">http://tinyurl.com/3gjob</a><br/>
& elsewhere<br/>
that the entire bernini colonnades including all of their several propylaea <br/>
are entirely in vatican territory<br/>
even tho these bulge outside the basic ellipse both at the portals & to a <br/>
lesser extent at the interior ends of the elliptical colonnades as well<br/>
<br/>
yes thats right<br/>
i believe in not just the 2 outer bulges of itva from the basic ellipse but <br/>
4 in all<br/>
<br/>
<br/>
thirdly<br/>
i believe that the projections of the ends of the correct travertine line <br/>
back into the colonnade arms<br/>
past the interruptions of the bulging propylaea<br/>
will prove to be in faithful alignment with the outer edge of some <br/>
architectural feature or other<br/>
as yet unknown<br/>
<br/>
possibly the ellipse formed by the outer edges of the column bases<br/>
tho i think this is erroneously indicated as a succession of straight lines <br/>
in the second graphic overlay pic<br/>
<br/>
or possibly the ellipse formed by the outer edge of the basic colonnade <br/>
floor<br/>
which however may be the same thing as the outer edges of the column bases<br/>
<br/>
still note in fig03a the travertine edge appears to begin from the edge of a <br/>
plinth which slightly enlarges the columnar base<br/>
& i think the outer line of this plinth may be resumed by the edge of the <br/>
colonnade floor<br/>
so there could well be a slight difference between these 2 edges<br/>
<br/>
or possibly it is the ellipse formed by some overhead feature<br/>
tho i am prepared to believe there could well be vertical differentiation of <br/>
sovereignty here<br/>
so as to conveniently include any overhang in vatican territory without <br/>
necessarily projecting its edge onto the ground<br/>
because many if not most of the other outer walls of the vatican are far <br/>
from perfectly vertical either<br/>
<br/>
<br/>
fourth<br/>
& thanx to this overview<br/>
<a rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://www.photo.net/photo/pcd0800/bernini-colonnade-3.4.jpg">http://www.photo.net/photo/pcd0800/bernini-colonnade-3.4.jpg</a><br/>
& especially to the second overlay pic again<br/>
i am led to believe by the perfect alignment of the elliptical base of the <br/>
stairs with the outermost column base edge<br/>
that whatever the exact dimensions of the bulges<br/>
their longer or outer edges will describe elliptical curves concentric with <br/>
all the inner ellipses<br/>
tho i believe their shorter or side edges<br/>
which would similarly be sectors of itva<br/>
will be straight edged & perpendicular to both ellipses<br/>
<br/>
<br/>
<br/>
also noteworthy<br/>
tho perhaps of less importance & interest<br/>
the exact shapes of the 2 lesser bulges arent so clear yet<br/>
but the above aerial view does include at least one of them<br/>
<br/>
& one possibly important detail that i still havent seen a view of is the <br/>
outer lines of the colonnade floors<br/>
since everybody seems to take their pix inside the square<br/>
<br/>
it is clear the propylaea are curved as well as stepped on the outside<br/>
& it is clear the basic colonnades have stairs all along their inner edges<br/>
but i still dont know if the basic colonnades also have similar stairs along <br/>
their outer edges<br/>
& if so what relation these might have to the basic itva ellipse<br/>
<br/>
presumably no relation or effect at all in any case<br/>
since they would have to fall outside the columnar bases & the basic <br/>
colonnade floor edge<br/>
but this is admittedly a loose end in my visualization<br/>
<br/>
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