Subject: RE: [BoundaryPoint] nyonqc location was Re: special congrats may be in order for czdepl improvement
Date: Dec 07, 2005 @ 17:45
Author: aletheia kallos (aletheia kallos <aletheiak@...>)
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> I would be very sceptical of placing much/anyhttp://www.fgdl.org/metadata/fgdc_html/cntbnd.fgdc.htm
> reliance on that map for
> detailed and highly precise navigation purposes.
> There is no evidence that
> it is the output of proper surveying or reference to
> official
> documents/treaties etc., and I would suggest that
> there is significant
> cartographic production latitude employed to make it
> look nice and pretty
> (and perfectly useful for most purposes).
>
> I don't have the USGS quad for that area (but will
> get it shortly) but
> attached is the relevant section from the Canadian
> Government 1:50000 topo
> for reference.
>
>
> _____
>
> From: BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com]
> On Behalf Of aletheiak
> Sent: Wednesday, December 07, 2005 3:44 AM
> To: BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [BoundaryPoint] nyonqc location was Re:
> special congrats may be in
> order for czdepl improvement
>
>
> agreed & no biggie in any case
> but a really interesting upshot of all this is the
> following pair of more
> detailed & reliable
> looking maps of nyonqc than i have ever seen before
> http://www.akwesasne.ca/AkwesasneMap.pdf
> evidently confirming that its location is indeed not
> at ibc turnpoint 1
> as the usgs topos & many other maps show
> but at some other also probably geodetically
> specified point or window
> a couple hundred meters closer to the right bank
> from there
> & possibly even legally specified as being in the
> middle of the seaway
> channel cut
> for thats what it at least looks like
>
> --- In BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com, "Lowell G.
> McManus"
> <mcmanus71496@m...>
> wrote:
> >
> > Mike D.,
> >
> > I understand what you are saying, but I think you
> and I just interpreted
> Hugh's
> > second-paragraph question differently.
> >
> > Oh, I don't know that there was ever a buoy
> marking the Lake Pontchartrain
>
> > parish quadripoint. If there was, I seriously
> doubt that it's there
> anymore.
> >
> > Lowell G. McManus
> > Leesville, Louisiana, USA
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "aletheia kallos" <aletheiak@y...>
> > To: <boundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2005 2:35 PM
> > Subject: Re: [BoundaryPoint] Re: special congrats
> may be in order for
> czdepl
> > improvement
> >
> >
> > > lowell
> > > you may well know better about louisiana & or in
> > > general & i hope you do
> > > but the difficulty with your florida example &
> perhaps
> > > all of these you mention
> > > since the question rightly asks & the bill you
> were
> > > trying to fit is for more precision rather than
> just
> > > more officialness
> > > is that the available geocoordinates are neither
> > > officially legal nor precise enough to be more
> useful
> > > than say the actual physical landform
> indications we
> > > have at czdepl
> > > or than any other geopositional guesses for that
> > > matter i suppose
> > >
> > > here for example
> > >
>
> > > you could probably find at least somez=18&n=4983683&e=525991&s=50&size=l&u=6&datum=nad83&layer=DRG25
> quasiofficial
> > > version of your & our dear glhemaokpa
> quintipoint
> > > down to a best guessed square foot i believe
> > > & despite the disclaimer 2 clicks down that says
> > > the data included in this application are based
> on
> > > interpretation of available info & shouldnt be
> > > construed as legally binding
> > > you might still have wanted to conclude you had
> > > arrived at something on the order of the correct
> > > square foot
> > > which would be great since thats about the size
> of the
> > > window you would need to stand in
> > > for a class b try
> > > but of course it is spurious or haphazard
> accuracy in
> > > their case & they pretty well admit it
> > > while what we are looking for is both full
> > > authenticity & as much real accuracy as possible
> > >
> > > & if you go to the ruling bible in this case
> > > for the legal descriptions on which their
> guesses are
> > > evidently based
> > > http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?
> App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=Ch0007/ch0007.htm
> > > looking under glades hendry martin okeechobee &
> palm
> > > beach
> > > you find it is just an indefinite definition & a
> > > purely hypothetical public land corner that the
> > > quasiofficial guess is based on
> > >
> > >
> > > & bill & i realized this too btw at the time
> when we
> > > visited circa 2000
> > > but we based our try on the geocoords we were
> able to
> > > lovingly pull off the paper usgs topo
> > > which was a similarly quasiofficial & similarly
> > > quasireliable source
> > > we knew full well
> > > but again it was all we had to go on at the time
> > > & certainly good enough because this was in the
> days
> > > of selective availability
> > > & even the 2 gps receivers we had on board
> werent
> > > enough to be absolutely sure we had the correct
> > > integral degminsec or 100 foot square
> > >
> > > so when we crossed our fingers & dropped our
> buoy
> > > there
> > > it was not only the state of play for glhemaokpa
> at
> > > the time but the state of the art for civilian
> > > multipoint buoy emplacement in general i think
> > > & no matter that our buoy cable had another 20
> feet of
> > > play in it too
> > > nor that it was probably too frail to survive
> the next
> > > cold front
> > > let alone a hurricane
> > >
> > > & perhaps if we went back today with 2 gpsrs & a
> fresh
> > > buoy & cable & cinderblock
> > > we could hit the likeliest 10 foot square
> > > thanx just to the loss of selective availability
> > > but i think based on the above data we could not
> at
> > > all yet hit the correct or even the likeliest
> square
> > > foot
> > >
> > >
> > > nyonqc is a whole nother matter
> > > but the end result looks pretty much the same
> from
> > > here
> > >
> > > in fact after years of research & a personal
> visit try
> > > there too
> > > i have still not yet able to confirm that the
> turning
> > > point number 1 shown here
> > > http://topozone.com/map.asp?
>
> > > & geopositioned here=== message truncated ===
>