--- In
BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com, "Lowell G. McManus"
<mcmanus71496@m...> wrote:
> I agree with your judgment that the term "mean" is irrelevant at
MDVAWV. Unless
> some legal basis emerges for the word "mean," the notion
likely comes from the
> Virginia statute on riparian land ownership that I quoted below.
The statute is
> catch-all for all waters--those subject to tidal fluctuation and
those not. Had
> Virginia been an inland state with no tides, the word "mean"
could have been
> omitted with no loss of precision. Tides cycle twice daily
commonly but not always or everywhere
universally they do cycle every 19 years
& the term mean low water mark can refer to either or both of
these cycles
there might even be a mean mean or lean mean low water mark
combining the 2
but probably just for fun
& tho none of these means applies to mdvawv or dcmdvan
they do suggest the idea of looking for whatever means do apply
to evaluate the water marks that we will actually find there
http://pa.water.usgs.gov/potomac/graph_explanation.html
suggests an october visit might not be so bad on average
hurricanes etc aside
& this might afford an adequately low low to be credible as a low
tho it would be hard to beat the end of a cold winter for that
i could even imagine these tripoints almost reaching the thalweg
under all the right natural & artificially imposed conditions
& as for how far they retreat back toward the high water mark
when the river rises
i think the usgs topos are more credible than usual in these
cases since they are after all at least quasi official since 1928
& they do endeavor to keep the river within its banks
& fortunately we should be able to compare the depicted
positions with the water edge position we actually encounter
so as to derive a distance from the observed water edge to the
truest available tripoint position in each case
so that might settle dcmdvan pretty well
& the mdva & mdwv convergents of mdvawv pretty well too
but i am still waiting for the callback on vawv
, but a rushing
> inland river such as the upper Potomac has all manner of crazy
swings in its
> level without much cyclical regularity or predictability.
>
> With no specific legal guidance as to how to find the low-water
mark, we must
> resort to our own reason. The functional rationale for the
placement of the
> boundary at the low-water mark is to allow riparian owners
access to the river
> (for commerce, water supply, etc.) at all possible river levels.
Suppose the
> river fell lower than ever heretofore known. Then, that's the
low-water mark,
> at least at the moment. To have it otherwise would allow
Maryland to say, "You
> Virginians can't trespass that far into our river bed!" This would
defeat the
> purpose of guaranteeing to Virginians sovereign access to the
water.
>
> However, although the Black-Jenkins Award of 1877 gave
Maryland sovereignty over
> the river to Virginia's low-water mark, the fourth article further
gives
> Virginia "a right to such use of the river beyond the line of
low-water mark as
> may be necessary to the full enjoyment of her riparian
ownership" so long as it
> doesn't impede navigation or use by Maryland. Just last
December 9th, the
> Supremes cited this sentence in finding Maryland powerless to
prevent, regulate,
> or even require a permit for the Fairfax County Water Authority
to operate an
> intake at mid-stream so as to obtain the cleanest water.
>
> Lowell G. McManus
> Leesville, Louisiana, USA
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "aletheiak" <aletheiak@y...>
> To: <BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 4:04 PM
> Subject: [BoundaryPoint] Re: dcmdvan & mdvawv retries
continued
>
>
>
> yes & i think all these data only further substantiate an
> exclusively maritime application for the term
> mean low water mark
> & thus its utter confusion & irrelevancy here at mdvawv
>
> & its irrelevancy at dcmdvan too btw
> for that matter
> as just any plain low water mark should be equally good there
> too
>
>
> the funny thing is that there doesnt seem to be any clear idea
> anywhere of the low water mark of a stream
> let alone its mean low water mark
> an apparent finesse of precision without new meaning or
insight
>
> but it makes me realize that whatever is meant by the term
> it is perhaps almost as much a reference to a living
changeable
> line as is
> say
> the term thalweg is
>
> so we are never going to pin it down once & forever in any case
>
> & in fact we might only be able to observe the low water mark
as
> the actual & variable edge of the river whenever the water level
> remains below some threshold that somehow signifies to
> someone that a sufficient lack of water has been reached for
its
> edge to be taken seriously as the actual living state line marker
>
> & at all higher stages
> well
> one would just have to remember or imagine where the water
> edge was horizontally when it was last low enough to qualify
>
> so in that way
> under the right & not too terribly rare conditions
> the true & variable mdvawv tripoint position might become
> experientially determinate
> & so might be experimentally determined
> for that moment in time
> by the trypointers themselves
>
> but again
> this assumes vawv can even be coaxed down to the true low
> water mark
>
> for i dont think these right conditions could ever be right
enough
> to cause mdvawv to truly reach the veggie line
> plat & legal description to the contrary notwithstanding
> as the lowness of low water would still have to be taken at
least
> somewhat in earnest
>
> & the question for us may just be
> how low is low enough
> &or how earnest is earnest enough