Subject: Re: MXUS Treaty 1970
Date: Jul 07, 2003 @ 04:18
Author: L. A. Nadybal ("L. A. Nadybal" <lnadybal@...>)
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--- In BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com, "acroorca2002" <orc@o...> wrote:
> again
> in the absence of any wording that clearly establishes a
> nonstandard regime by explicitly delineating a vertical
> differentiation of some kind
> & in view of the reiteration of the defining & standard provision
> practically verbatim from 1884 to 1970
> namely that
> the monument shall denote the boundary or dividing line for all
> the purposes of the bridge
> it seems to me that nothing of any relevance to your question
> has changed at all
>
> moreover
> among the purposes of a bridge
> are
> to rise above the ground it rests on
> & to form a passageway across that ground
> & even to occupy the ground &or the space above it
> in order to maintain the special purposes & nature or treatment
> of that ground itself
>
> indeed to carry this line to its logical & necessary conclusion
> without the special ground & markers there can be no bridges
> & without the bridges & markers
> there cant even be any specially treated ground
>
> so it seems to me
> both from what is actually said & from what is not
> in every regard
> the bridge includes or subsumes the land underneath it
> &
> in relation to our starting proposition
> which is that boundaries are vertically continuous
> unless otherwise specified
> if indeed they are ever otherwise specified
> well once again
> as i see it
> no news is no news
>
> --- In BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com, "Lowell G. McManus"
> <mcmanus71496@m...> wrote:
> > I have abstracted the entire 1970 treaty, and it contains some
> fairly unorthodox
> > provisions! My abstraction is attached in Word format. Yes, I
> know, I went
> > overboard, but I wanted y'all to appreciate the full thrust of the
> treaty
> > without my having to transcribe it verbatim.
> >
> > For those who don't care to read the attached, here is the
> Article relative to
> > bridges:
> >
> > "The boundary on international bridges which cross the Rio
> Grande or the
> > Colorado River shall be shown by an appropriate monument
> exactly over the
> > international boundary determined by this Treaty at the time of
> demarcation.
> > When in the judgment of the Commission the variations of the
> international
> > boundary should warrant that the monument on any bridge
> should be relocated, it
> > shall so recommend to the two Governments and with their
> approval may proceed to
> > the reinstallation. This monument shall denote the boundary
> for all the
> > purposes of such bridge. Any rights other than those relating
> to the bridge
> > itself shall be determined, in case later changes occur, in
> accordance with the
> > provisions of this Treaty."
> >
> > Compare that with the respective language from the
> Convention of 1884 [as quoted
> > by L.N.], which document is expressly terminated by the 1970
> Treaty:
> >
> > "If any international bridge have been or shall be built across
> either rivers
> > named, the point on such bridge exactly over the middle of the
> main channel as
> > herein determined shall be marked by a suitable monument,
> which shall denote the
> > dividing line of all purposes of such bridge, notwithstanding
> any change in the
> > channel which may thereafter supervene. Because of the
> frequent changes in the
> > course of the rivers, any right other than in the bridge itself and
> in the
> > ground on which it shall be built shall in the event of any
> subsequent change be
> > determined in accordance with the general provisions of this
> convention."
> >
> > Note that the 1970 Treaty drops all reference to the ground on
> which bridges are
> > built.
> >
> > I think that we sorted out all relevant questions a few days ago
> as they would
> > have been under the 1884 Convention, but this 1970 Treaty
> sends us back to the
> > drawing board. I throw it out there you, and I await your
> comments.
> >
> > Lowell G. McManus
> > Leesville, Louisiana, USA