all very interesting
but i still have to wonder
what of our friends the surveyors who routinely give
gps generated latitudes & longitudes in degminsec plus
5 decimal places
which is to say
in submillimetric range
i know they pay a big price to buy as well as to lug &
operate this stuff
but my question is
is there no intermediate state of art & price point
that russ might be at
between your everymans level & the super technical
survey level
thatd serve his also considerable professional needs
in piloting ships
but please understand too
i am actually not so interested in this super gpsr
tech for hapiri
since i have russ himself for the eye witness here
just by chance
hahaha
as i am interested in it for my several other hard
berkshire nuts
which really would benefit from such a huge
improvement
from 100 foot range down to 3 foot range
if true
& that would make all the difference in the world
in some of the more hideously impassable & overgrown
places i know my er geocaches are buried under
& possibly even smithereened under
like say a fallen cathedral pine tree
funnily i never felt either selective availability or
its loss as a loss
& have been eschewing much of the hi tech til now
tho i acknowledge it is nothing to sneeze at
& since my objective has become a semblance of
perfection
i may no longer have the luxury of omitting anything
--- Hugh Wallis <
hugh@...> wrote:
> I very much doubt that any civilian would have
> anything more accurate than
> what I described and it seems unlikely to me even
> for military personnel. As
> I understand it the errors are not typically in the
> receiver (the "r" bit of
> GPSr) but in the doppler perturbations of the
> signals from the satellites
> which themselves are not totally stable up there in
> space. Corrections
> provided by WAAS on the North American continent
> (and similar technologies
> are, I believe, in development elsewhere in the
> world) get you to the 10m
> point but then you are on your own. A fellow
> geocacher, who also happens to
> have been one of the Iraq weapons inspectors, had
> nothing better than what
> you or I can buy off the shelf while he was tilting
> at windmills of mass
> destruction over there. I imagine Russ might have
> been just a bit over
> enthusiastic in his description - but obviously a
> very kind and interesting
> individual with whom you seem lucky to have become
> acquainted :)
>
> The location in your photographs appears to have a
> good unimpeded view of
> the sky and so, on a clear day, you should be able
> to get the most accurate
> readings possible since the signals will, at least,
> not be disturbed by
> trees or clouds (which can be very annoying at
> times)
>
> It was, indeed, very nice of Billy C (inspired, as
> you say, by the demise of
> the 20th century) to allow the use of a few billion
> dollars worth of
> satellite technology for such important pusuits as
> those which engage us!!
>
>
> _____
>
> From: BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com]
> On Behalf Of aletheia kallos
> Sent: Friday, October 21, 2005 5:08 PM
> To: BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: RE: [BoundaryPoint] hapiri geocoords but
> why
>
>
> haha
> & thanx very much hugh
> for this substantial corroboration of my overall
> impression of gps tech
>
> & i assume you are talking about most commercial
> civilian gpsr models
> since we know the top of the line will be much finer
> albeit costlier etc
>
> so russ either has some kind of a kickass receiver
> to
> be accurate within so little as 3 feet
> or he is mistaken about its ability
>
> but since he says he uses it for piloting yachts via
> waypoints that have been determined from sheet maps
> i think i might want to just call him but not bump
> him
> on this
> & that way maybe get to see so rare & precious an
> instrument at play
>
>
> & yikes what if i could induce him
> or just borrow it
> to help me find the several other tough nut
> classmates
> of his own sunken treasure rock
>
> then i might really have a very earnest shot at
> bagging all 44 class a
>
>
> btw
> earlier episodes did indeed at least mention a
> sunlit
> glimpse at the pond bed in time of extreme low water
>
> & did at least entertain snorkeling if not scuba
> tho negotiating the muck in the bed is the greater
> challenge than the water column itself
> & the distance has proved to be farther out from
> shore
> than was previously thought or even previously
> discernible without flotation
> tho i realize i cant expect everyone to have caught
> every detail of every episode
> & am in fact very gratified that you have caught any
> of any of it
>
> but didnt we have clinton & the 20th century to
> thank
> for the demise of selective availability
>
> --- Hugh Wallis <hugh@...> wrote:
>
> > Even with precise coordinates and a WAAS enabled
> > GPSr you will not get
> > closer than about 10m accuracy. Just try standing
> in
> > one spot with the GPSr
> > and watch it wander around over a short period of
> > time to see what I mean.
> > Waypoint averaging might help but you still have
> to
> > get down underwater for
> > the class a find by the sound of it. That's what
> > makes the last 30m of
> > geocaching hunts so much fun!! It's a lot better
> > than the pre 2002 situation
> > when there were deliberate inaccuracies introduced
> > to the GPS system "for
> > security reasons".
> >
> > It's a lot better to get a HUGE pump and suck all
> > the water out of the pond
> > - or maybe take scuba diving lessons :) :) Do you
> > have any friends at the
> > local fire department?
> >
> > Maybe waiting for dry weather and a clear day so
> you
> > can get a look through
> > the water will have to suffice.
> >
> > Good luck with the continued hunt
> >
> >
> > _____
> >
> > From: BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com
> > [mailto:BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com]
> > On Behalf Of aletheia kallos
> > Sent: Friday, October 21, 2005 1:14 PM
> > To: boundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: [BoundaryPoint] hapiri geocoords but why
> >
> >
> > owing to a crush of other events this morning
> > i scarcely resumed the hapiri try again before
> noon
> > when i finally succeeded in extracting from the
> usgs
> > topo the following utm zone 18 geocoordinate data
> > by careful measurement & eyeballing & computation
> > easting 636632m
> > northing 4697380m
> > but this is probably only to about the nearest
> > couple
> > of meters of truth as i understand it
> >
> > add to that the 3 foot range russ claims for his
> gps
> > receiver
> > & we have already reopened practically the same 10
> > foot window of his recollection
> > so i have to wonder if he had in mind any better
> > source of data than the usgs topo
> > or if anyone reading this knows of any better data
> > source
> > whether generally or specifically for hapiri
> >
> > i can tell you the national geographics electronic
> > pinpointing process that the map salesman
> performed
> > for me yesterday was around 33 meters off on the
> > easting & 215 off on the northing
> > tho i dont know if that was complicated by any
> human
> > error
> >
> > likely the first number wasnt & the second was
> > tho they both made me glad i bought the paper map
> >
> > but anyway
> > whether anyone can help with this or not
> > it is already good reason to call russ the owner
> > back
> > first to deliver these data & ask what better data
> i
> > could get for him
> > & possibly also
> > to wonder if there even is much point in using the
> > gps
> > for this
>
=== message truncated ===
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