ok i have checked the text of the treaty of lausanne of 1923
& there is nothing about these bridges in it
so the ibs analysts got their info about the bridges elsewhere
very possibly from the same official 1925 maps they based their
own maps 1 & 2 on
& a data transfer situation like that makes my guess about a
numbering error in transcription quite a good probability
& as if just to underscore how easily such a screw up could
occur
i find i must correct my own recent correction of it itself below
oops
for i see now that the road bridge should actually cross the river
between markers 26 & 27
according to all the other data we have seen
& not between 25 & 26 as i myself just misspoke
nor between 24 & 25 as the ibs says
& finally
getting back to the aerial photo
which showed the island too long & too close to the railroad
bridge
as well as almost or actually attached to the bank
well all that could easily have happened in a time of low water
level
aha
so there are no longer any serious objections to this
identification of island q
& i really do hope you will check it out on the ground now
or at least from one of the bridges or the banks
in view of all the fun already invested in it
--- In
BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com, "aletheiak"
<aletheiak@y...> wrote:
>
> further & better confirmation at
> http://multimap.com
> where you can point & click your way right to island q
>
> for there it is shown to be exactly the length & exactly the
> distance below the railroad bridge that the ibs says it should
be
>
> which is quite a testimonial to multimap btw
> establishing it on a level above all the others
>
> & the one fly in the ointment
> an apparently misguided ibs comment about there being an
> international road bridge between markers 24 & 25
> or directly across island q
> might be explained away as a mistranscription of markers 25
& 26
> aha
> for then everything makes perfect sense
>
> so i will upgrade my guess now from decisive to emphatic
> or all but qed
>
> --- In BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com, aletheia kallos
> <aletheiak@y...> wrote:
> > on further reflection
> > all the maps i have seen agree about the railroad
> > & there is not likely to be another railroad crossing
> > than this one
> >
> > & it is not so surprising that the bridge itself cant
> > be seen in the sat pic
> > nor that the island just below it has apparently grown
> > & crept closer to it over the past 80 years
> > while also practically reattaching itself to the
> > turkish bank btw
> >
> > so i will guess decisively at this point that island q
> > is indeed the long narrow one shown almost touching
> > the left bank near the bottom of this last sat pic
> >
> > --- aletheia kallos <aletheiak@y...> wrote:
> >
> > > this is almost definitely the right frame
> > > for i recognize both the elcili area near the top
> > > & the great bend area around pithion at the bottom
> > >
> > > & so your roughly 25 km of coverage here almost
> > > certainly includes the entire probable target area
> > > based on all the distances given in the ibs text
> > >
> > > & so many more candidate islands now to choose from
> > > hahaha
> > >
> > > but the railroad bridge also mentioned by the ibs as
> > > being a couple of km upstream from island q is not
> > > visible in this photo
> > >
> > > no bridge visible anywhere in this photo
> > > oops
> > >
> > > but perhaps it is just too narrow &or too dark to
> > > show
> > > up
> > > for the ibs 41 map 1 does indeed show a railroad
> > > crossing
> > > & shows it roughly where an unbridged road crossing
> > > does appear
> > > at lower right in this sat pic
> > > just below the stream confluence
> > >
> > > not that that railroad necessarily has to be the
> > > right
> > > railroad either tho
> > > hahaha
> > >
> > > so i dont know where that leaves us
> > > except there is a candidate island just below this
> > > apparently unbridged road crossing
> > >
> > > a bit too close & a bit too big tho
> > > hmmm
> > > not that islands or bridges on this famously wild
> > > river could be expected to stay put for 80 years
> > > either tho
> > >
> > > so i have to admit we still need more data
> > > but are damn close
> > >
> > > possibly just off frame downstream too
> > > hahaha
> > >
> > > --- Jesper Nielsen <jesniel@i...> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Furthe south
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: aletheiak
> > > > To: BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com
> > > > Sent: Saturday, March 19, 2005 12:08 AM
> > > > Subject: [BoundaryPoint] Re: Q, the divided
> > > island
> > > > on GRTR
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > if you go to
> > > > http://www.locatienet.nl
> > > > & give elcili for plaats in the ik wil naar box
> > > > & change nederland to turkije
> > > > & click on toon karte
> > > > the toon town map they give does show a best
> > > > available
> > > > candidate island a few km upriver from elcili
> > > > but obviously a better map is still needed
> > > >
> > > > also i have concluded your sat pix are indeed
> > > too
> > > > far north
> > > >
> > > > --- In BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com, aletheia
> > > > kallos
> > > > <aletheiak@y...> wrote:
> > > > > edirne itself is about 10km upriver from where
> > > > the
> > > > > border kicks back into the maritsa
> > > > > & elcili & q are about 40km downriver from
> > > > edirne
> > > > >
> > > > > so unless you have some better idea of the
> > > > direction &
> > > > > scale of these pix than i do
> > > > > my guess is they are both too far north in any
> > > > case
> > > > >
> > > > > --- Jesper Nielsen <jesniel@i...> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Enclosed satellite images south of Edirne.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Jesper
> > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > From: aletheiak
> > > > > > To: BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com
> > > > > > Sent: Friday, March 18, 2005 10:45 PM
> > > > > > Subject: [BoundaryPoint] Re: Q, the
> > > divided
> > > > island
> > > > > > on GRTR
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > on the map you provide in your second link
> > >
> > > > > > the island q is of course too small to be
> > > > shown
> > > > > > but it must be situated pretty close to
> > > the
> > > > town
> > > > > > of elcili
> > > > > > near the lower left corner of the upper
> > > > right
> > > > > > quadrant
> > > > > > since this ibs text & its 2 maps do give
> > > > exact
> > > > > > mileages & show
> > > > > > landmarks that permit this guess to be
> > > > constructed
> > > > > > which tho still only a guess
> > > > > > is awfully well educated
> > > > > >
> > > > > > on a better map we might be able to put
> > > our
> > > > finger
> > > > > > on q because
> > > > > > it is of substantial & known length anyway
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --- In BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com,
> > > > "Jesper
> > > > > > Nielsen"
> > > > > > <jesniel@i...> wrote:
> > > > > > > Where is the divided island, Q mentioned
> > > > on page
> > > > > > 7 of
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
http://www.law.fsu.edu/library/collection/LimitsinSeas/IBS041.pdf
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > http://www.adiyamanli.org/MapofTurkey/a1.htm
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > >
> > > http://www.sieurasia.com/english/html/eng_index.htm
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Jesper
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
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> > > >
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