sharp shooting lowell
& an exquisitely beautiful question
about which however i cant be too brief
since
as you see
my use of the terms southernmost source etc
was indeed a telescoping of the data you add here
& my tale there was already so long & complicated even
without this technically necessary clarification
& it is in fact impossible to answer with certainty
where the
head of the altamaha river really lies
or lay in 1732
& happily i dont think it matters what the writers
geographic knowledge nor the intent of their wording
actually was since a sawanabori of the altamaha does i
think fairly obviously proceed up the ocmulgee rather
than the oconee
& then farther up i think it also prefers what is so
poignantly called the south river over the alcovy
river
so it has already kept left at 2 major forks
whether consciously trying to bear south or not
& is then soon in the burbs & i believe finally within
the city limits of atlanta itself
while still on south river or one of its most
promising feeder creeks
at latitude
33deg 43min 12sec
best i can tell from here
& of course georgia would have wanted to keep bearing
left as much as possible so as to keep the latitude as
low as possible & her territory as large as possible
so allowing for a little extra intention to that
effect
i think we could reduce or rather round the guess
to an even 33 degrees 43 minutes
& not attempt to positively identify the truth head or
vertex of altamaha
aka the northeast corner of the ghost clave
for i dont think anyone really performed this
sawanabori or made any such determination between 1732
& 1763
after which the question became moot
until 2000
when bp was invented
& who knows
maybe some day
a physical sawanabori of the altamaha yet too
--- "Lowell G. McManus" <
mcmanus71496@...> wrote:
> Mike,
>
> I'd like to have you briefly expound on the true
> head of the Altamaha River, if
> you have ascertained it by any sawanobori on maps.
>
> The pertinent wording of the first Georgia charter
> of 1732 (per BUS&SS) is:
> "...from the most northern part of a stream or river
> there, commonly called the
> Savannah, all along the sea coast to the southward,
> unto the most southern
> stream of a certain other great water or river
> called the Altamaha, and westerly
> from the heads of the said rivers, respectively, in
> direct lines to the south
> seas..."
>
> Note that we need the Altamaha's HEAD, not it's
> "southernmost source." It is my
> interpretation that the words "most southern stream"
> in the charter refer to the
> southernmost of its several MOUTHS among the Sea
> Islands as one comes "along the
> sea coast to the southward."
>
> Thanks.
>
> Lowell G. McManus
> Leesville, Louisiana, USA
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "aletheia kallos" <aletheiak@...>
> To: <BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Saturday, March 19, 2005 11:05 PM
> Subject: [BoundaryPoint] huge but forgotten ghost
> clave rediscovered
> 1732gb2sc1763
>
>
> >
> > it is well known that south carolina once believed
> she
> > owned a long narrow stripe of western lands that
> > extended her territory by half again its present
> > breadth
> > & indeed all the way to the mississippi river
> > across more than 400 miles of what is now just the
> > northernmost few leagues of georgia & alabama &
> > mississippi
> >
> > & the reason this is so well known is that she
> ceded
> > these lands to the federal government in 1787
> > by a comical mistake due to geographic ignorance
> > for tho she had as recently as 1763 really owned
> more
> > western lands than any other colony at the time
> > she actually had none at all left to give away by
> 1787
> > & should rather have considered herself one of the
> 7
> > original short stripe states from the start
> > rather than a 7th original long stripe state
> >
> > & as luck would have it
> > the american flag has evolved in such a way that
> it
> > does correctly symbolize the 6 true original
> > long stripe states
> > or western land ceding
> > states
> > by the 6 long stripes
> > &
> > the 7 true original
> > short stripe states
> > or nonceding states
> > including sc
> > by the 7 short stripes
> >
> > can you imagine if the stars & stripes had had to
> have
> > their red 7th or middle stripe as an additional
> long
> > stripe running beneath the starry field
> > instead of the short stripe this flag has almost
> > always officially kept in the middle position to
> the
> > right of the starry field
> >
> > but fortunately south carolina only wanted to be
> > yet never really was
> > a long stripe state
> >
> > & btw
> > in case you have ever wondered exactly which
> stripes
> > symbolize which states
> > then i think we can say with confidence
> > proceeding from top to bottom
> > & of course factoring in their rank of admission
> to
> > the union also
> > first the 7 short upper stripes
> > de pa nj md sc nh ri
> > followed by the 6 long lower ones
> > ga ct ma va ny nc
> >
> > & of course the 50 stars can be similarly
> identified
> > but thats a lot easier & more straightforward
> >
> > for example the lone star state star is the 28th
> > or the one keeping closest company with & in fact
> just
> > to the left of the 4th short or md stripe
> >
> > but yikes i digress even from my digression
> >
> > for what has been almost if not completely
> forgotten
> > is that sc once really did have not only western
> but
> > also southern lands of enormous extent
> > & all of them contiguous til 1732
> > when some were cut out from the middle
> > & most thus became a large exclave of the small
> > remaining metropole we recognize today as sc
> > til their own extinction in 1763
> >
> > & here is how it all happened
> >
> > the carolina charter of 1665 extended that
> province
> > westward as far as the pacific & southward as far
> as
> > the 29th parallel
> >
> > today this includes the northern half of florida
> > plus most of the rest of the old south & southwest
> > & indeed about a fifth of mexico
> >
> > at that time carolina outstripped even virginia as
> > largest province
> >
> > & when the nc sc division was created in 1729
> > sc then inherited title to all this southern part
> of
> > carolina
> > which was in fact the lions share of it
> > & probably still the largest province
> > since va had by then lost much of her north too
> >
> > when georgia was chartered in 1732
> > overriding the part of south carolina that lay
> between
> > the savannah & altamaha rivers
> > as well as everywhere westward to the pacific
> between
> > the latitudes of their respective northernmost &
> > southernmost sources
> > sc was thus left in possession of a legal exclave
> >
> > & this transcontinental exclave remained legally
> in
> > effect everywhere west of the altamaha & of the
> > seacoast to its south
> > as far as the 29th parallel
> >
> > in other words it extended to the pacific from a
> > northeast extremity around atlanta & a southeast
> > extremity around daytona beach
> > tho it is true that the spanish had an overlapping
> &
> > better claim to all of florida & mexico
> > & the french a similarly overlapping & better
> claim to
> > all of louisiana
> >
> > but when the esfrgb tripartite treaty of paris
> > on 10 feb 1763
> > extinguished british claims west of the
> mississippi
> > as well as spanish claims south of the 31st
> parallel
> > eastward of the mississipi & new orleans
> > the sc ghost exclave accordingly contracted in the
> > west from the pacific back to the mississippi
> > but was no longer overlapped in the east by the
> > spanish claim to florida
> >
> > thus sc regained undisputed title to most of
> formerly
> > spanish florida & retained most of what would
> become
> > ga & al & ms
> > at least for 3 months or so anyway
> > until the board of trade enjoined her on 30 may
> 1763
> > from selling land beyond the altamaha
>
=== message truncated ===
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