In this business, any interpretation is tentative (to one degree or another),
pending the receipt of better data.
Your conclusions regarding a virtual-only statutory northward extension of
Atwood's 1918 Maricopa-Yuma line are within the realm of possibility. The
Pima-Yuma line southward (if correctly depicted by the USGS), however, is
clearly out of agreement with the statutes. If there were never any suit or
survey, though, I'm wondering why the USGS puts the line where it does. Since
it's all federal land down there, not subject to local taxation, it makes no
practical difference. Pending the arrival of better data, I'm willing to write
it off as "just one of those things."
Lowell G. McManus
Leesville, Louisiana, USA
----- Original Message -----
From: "aletheiak" <aletheiak@...>
To: <BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, December 14, 2004 11:53 AM
Subject: [BoundaryPoint] Re: paleo lamaya initial monument & mapiyu corner cases
closed i think
>
>
> thanx tho thats why i say
> as has been widely presumed
>
> for all the statutes you keep citing actually say is
> 113d20m as defined by the atwood survey etc
>
> which doesnt at all necessarily mean that atwood reached & marked
> the points you all have been assuming he reached & marked
> &or in their case only implying he may have reached & marked
>
> but his court ordered survey of 113d20m along mayu alone is still
> sufficient for the wordings in the statutes to be intelligible &
> even technically correct
> provided all the mentioned meridional boundaries simply remain to be
> projected from existing 1908 & atwood mayu markers but are otherwise
> unmarked
> which is in fact my conclusion to date
>
> as always
> subject to better data of course
>
> it is your insistence on your interpretation of these data
> albeit now only a tentative insistence
> that is still not supported by any facts yet
>
> also
> ironically
> the piyu line appears to be not at all as stated in the statute
> but as i believe is clear from the topos
> actually cleaves not to atwood at all
> for that is what the jog is about
> but to the public land survey grid
> probably of slightly earlier date
> & another reason why atwood didnt have to go south from mapiyu
>
> & laya for her part
> in the absence of any known lawsuit & survey &or connectivity with
> the public land grid
> may also simply consist of nothing but the great circle arc that
> links the southernmost monument on the 1908 sector of the 113d20m
> line with the northernmost atwood 113d20m marker
> wherever it lies
> in any case
>
> these 2 bridge markers btw being probably at least a few deciseconds
> off the true meridian & off of each other
> given their vintage
>
> but modern gis tech can infer every point on that line anyone may
> ever wish to know
>
> so the statutes are technically ok on laya
> albeit slightly bogus on piyu
> & there never was & still isnt & may never be any need to waste
> money etc suing over & marking those particular deserts
>
> --- In BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com, "Lowell G. McManus"
> <mcmanus71496@m...> wrote:
> > Great digging, Mike! I agree with almost all of your conclusions,
> particularly
> > your new interpretation of the "Initial Monument" having been
> Atwood's--in light
> > of the fact that his work seems to have been driven by a Yuma v.
> Maricopa suit
> > in the same year.
> >
> > Your only conclusion with which I tentatively disagree is that the
> Atwood survey
> > never extended north or south of the then Maricopa-Yuma segment.
> My belief
> > otherwise is based on the statutory description of the boundaries
> of La Paz (
> > http://tinyurl.com/6bkg9 ), modern Yuma (
> http://tinyurl.com/4fqxh ), and Pima
> > ( http://tinyurl.com/52mbm toward the end) counties. Atwood
> probably set his 52
> > monuments pursuant to order of the Arizona Supremes, but unless
> the legislature
> > knows not whereof it speaks, he does seem to have surveyed farther
> both
> > northward and southward.
> >
> > Lowell G. McManus
> > Leesville, Louisiana, USA
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "aletheiak" <aletheiak@y...>
> > To: <BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com>
> > Sent: Monday, December 13, 2004 3:35 PM
> > Subject: [BoundaryPoint] paleo lamaya initial monument & mapiyu
> corner cases
> > closed i think
> >
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > aha
> > > it turns out there actually was a yuma county vs maricopa county
> > > 1918 border suit
> > > so the accumulated puzzle pieces now strongly suggest
> > > that it was the arizona supreme court that directed the atwood
> > > survey to do whatever it did in 1918
> > >
> > >
> > > & that this survey concerned naturally mayu & mayu only
> > > rather than everything south of the santa maria river & north of
> > > mexico
> > > as has been widely presumed
> > >
> > >
> > > & if this is true then atwood must have had to use his own
> original
> > > determinations for the mapiyu & mayayu tripoints for his mayu
> > > terminal points
> > >
> > >
> > > & so the mystery initial monument near lamaya must have been his
> own
> > > initial as well as terminal monument
> > > & thus actually the 52nd marker in his continuous series
> > >
> > >
> > > & this was presumably done without prejudice as to the actual
> > > position of either tripoint since it was only a mayu thing
> > >
> > > in the case of mapiyu i surmise the original atwood position
> stuck &
> > > never moved because it was based in the public land grid
> > >
> > > which btw on further examination also seems to be the cause of
> the
> > > jog & yaw beginning at mapiyu too & continuing southward to
> mexico
> > >
> > > but in the case of mayayu aka lamaya
> > > thompson evidently was empowered by the supreme court to
> establish
> > > the tripoint in 1924
> > > leaving atwoods 1918 initial & terminal rock 50 yards off
> > > & just an oddball & technically unauthorized yet duly marked
> point
> > > on laya
> > > indeed possibly the only monumented point on laya
> > > if only it still existed
> > >
> > >
> > > so
> > > just wanted to get that much off my chest
> > > tho there are more new details perhaps best left unreported too
> > > & tho it doesnt bag us a rock solid arizona tricounty point yet
> > > but it has been an education & a trip & possibly even a help
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
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