as mentioned
i couldnt be sure
& on closer examination i still cant
because the text occasionally varies its formulaic description of
the arcs from one example to the next
& evidently incorporates several geometric conundrums as well
what i can see is
there are in all 13 different arcs mentioned
in a total of 15 different numbered paragraphs
including your mentioned 10 paragraphs plus 36 49 54 58 & 59
which may or may not add to your count of 10 border arcs
i agree there could be as few as 10 arcs that the bjng border
actually follows
but in any case
i dont see why they would even have been mentioned if the
border isnt supposed to follow them
can you perhaps positively dispose of any or all 3 odd men out
from the mentioned 13
just to keep track
we have in sequence the following 13 villages as centers
with radii in km
okuta 8 & a half
guri 4
yashikira 8
grand bete 4
kenumbe 4
besi 8
gauzhi 3 & a half
lusi 3 & a half
naganzi 4
kade 4
kankali 5
gusin sura 4
daku 5
& about your map
i dont know what the mapmaker was doing or showing there
perhaps a temporary question or situation during wwii
i think modern dztn is the dash & dot line
not the black dash dash line
& of course the other convergents
lytn & dzly
are shown by the crosses
& i cant account for any of the other lines
but assume they are irrelevant to finding the tripoint
the only presently outstanding question i am aware of in this
vicinity is probably too small to be shown on this map
namely whether dztn meets the arc at its northeast terminal
or subdivides the arc 2km counterclockwise from there
http://home.worldonline.dk/jesniel/border/african_tripoints.htm#d
zlytn
so as i understand it
only 2 possible tripoint positions are on this arc
--- In
BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com, Michael Kaufman
<mikekaufman79@y...> wrote:
> BJNG - Ok by my count I get 10:
>
> Under Alignment section - 26, 33, 35, 42, 44, 47, 53,
> 55, 57, 60
> Which are the other one or two?
>
> Also: On http://www.manntaylor.com/FtSaintM.jpg - The
> solid green arrow almost points right to DZLYTN. What
> boundary is the hollow green arrow pointing to?
> Currently this must be all in DZ. And the line from
> the south - what is this? It would divide territory
> which is currently all in Libya. How many TPs
> (including ghost points) can be on this one arc?
>
>
> --- aletheiak <aletheiak@y...> wrote:
> > please look for several insertions
> >
> > --- In BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com, Michael
> > Kaufman
> > <mikekaufman79@y...> wrote:
> > > 1. DZLYTN http://www.manntaylor.com/FtSaintM.jpg
> > > (this could be DZLY and LYTN or just DZLY as per
> > msg.
> > > 13465)
> >
> > correct & we still dont know which is true
> > so you are right to keep counting it or them as
> > either 1 or 2
> > borders
> > but this is apparently only a single sweep of arc in
> > any case
> >
> > > 2. DZLY
> > >
> >
>
http://www.law.fsu.edu/library/collection/LimitsinSeas/maps/bs1
> > b.php
> > > 3. LYNE
> > >
> >
>
http://www.law.fsu.edu/library/collection/LimitsinSeas/maps/bs2.
> > php
> > > 4.-15. BJNG (12 of these?)
> >
> > i still cant be sure
> > but the following text seems to indicate either 11
> > or 12
> >
> >
>
http://www.law.fsu.edu/library/collection/LimitsinSeas/IBS091.pdf
> > > 16. NENG
> > >
> >
>
http://www.law.fsu.edu/library/collection/LimitsinSeas/IBS093.pdf
> > > (but not evident)
> >
> > it is evident in the above text
> > but i think we just havent yet found a good enough
> > map
> >
> > > 17.-??? MXUS (msg. 13937; how many are there?)
> >
> > unknown
> > but i believe only 1 has been reported so far
> > & suspect the 1970 mxus treaty will reveal all
> > if there are any others
> >
> > > SO,
> > > We can't put a firm number on it. Depends on 3
> > > variables:
> > > 1. Where DZLYTN falls. If there is a short LYTN
> > we
> > > have 18 not 17.
> > > 2. Also, do we know 12 for BJNG? So it would be
> > more
> > > or less if not exactly 12.
> > > 3. And how many more arcs for MXUS on the
> > channelized
> > > Rio Grande?
> > > I am not yet counting ITVA since I think here we
> > would
> > > be talking about features (not figures) which can
> > not
> > > be perfectly geometrically true arcs.
> >
> > true
> > & other reasons not to count any of the itva curves
> > are
> > that they are elliptical rather than circular
> > & that their total number is so highly debatable
> > amounting to either 1 or 3 or 5 or even more
> > depending on point of view
> >
> > what a mess
> > & good idea to sidestep it
> > on any grounds
> >
> >
> > so
> > we have
> > by this exact count
> > at least 16 international border arcs
> > but still perhaps as many as 18
> > or more
> > if more are found
> >
> > & they are evidently situated on 6 different borders
> > & 1 tripoint
> >
> > thanx
> >
> >
> >
> > of course some wag will now come along to remind us
> > that all
> > small & great circle arc borders
> > including every single segment between intervisible
> > markers
> > are technically border arcs too
> >
> > so we should add an extra zillion or 2
> >
> >
> > end insertions
> >
> > > --- aletheiak <aletheiak@y...> wrote:
> > > > arif
> > > > i too believed in this arc report about
> > easternmost
> > > > gmsn
> > > > & may even have been responsible for starting
> > the
> > > > rumor about it
> > > > but i have been unable to substantiate it
> > > >
> > > > this border is set at a fixed distance from the
> > > > river on both sides
> > > > presumably from both its banks rather than from
> > its
> > > > thalweg
> > > > just like the manh state line is offset from the
> > > > merrimack
> > > > except doubly so
> > > > as you probably also realized
> > > > & can see here
> > > >
> > >
> >
> http://www.lib.utexas.edu/maps/africa/gambia_pol88.jpg
> > > >
> > > > however
> > > > as beguilingly arclike as all this may seem
> > > > such a regime would not actually presuppose any
> > true
> > > > arcs at all
> > > >
> > > > except
> > > > i would agree
> > > > conceivably a single one centered at the
> > headspring
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > however
> > > > the source of the gambia river is not in gambia
> > > > but in senegal
> > > > as you can also see in the above map
> > > > & therefore the simple offset regime couldnt
> > project
> > > > such a
> > > > simple terminal arc sector
> > > >
> > > > only by varying the apparent regime & reducing
> > it to
> > > > a single
> > > > offset center point in the middle of the river
> > > > could such a final true arc have been produced
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > also the map doesnt show any such terminal
> > rounding
> > > > or bulge
> > > > as one would expect in such a case
> > > > but quite the contrary
> > > > something more like a foreshortening or
> > truncation
> > > > of the basic regime
> > > > & indeed it makes the cutoff point look quite
> > > > arbitrary & artificial
> > > > & somehow distinctly at odds with the basic
> > offset
> > > > regime
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > so at this point i think the existence of an arc
> > on
> > > > gmsn hasnt
> > > > been & probably wont be demonstrated
> > > > & was just a wishful thought & misconception in
> > the
> > > > first place
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > mind you
> > > > i dont actually know how the gmsn border does
> > > > accomplish this
> > > > remarkable turnabout at its east end if not in
> > some
> > > > approximation of an arc or arcs
> > > >
> > > > & i can still imagine how it might somehow
> > involve a
> > > > true arc or 2
> > > > based at some known terminal cross section of
> > the
> > > > river
> > > >
> > > > but i dont believe there is any text that
> > specifies
> > > > to this effect
> > > > nor any map that suggests it
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > meanwhile
> > > > i have scoured the ghost frgb lines of the
> > period
> > > > & have discovered nothing new
> > > > so our world class border arc census is again
> > > > stalled
> > > > at a top count of about 20 now & perhaps forever
> > > >
> > > > --- In BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com, Arif Samad
> >
> > > > <fHoiberg@y...> wrote:
> > > > > Not sure, but isn't there some (at least one
> > arc)
> > > > in
> > > > > the border of Senegal and Gambia. As far as I
> > > > > thought, the Easternmost point is directly
> > east of
> > > > the
> > > > > Center of the arc in that border.
> > > > > Arif
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
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