--- In
BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com, "bjbutlerus" <bjbutler@b...>
wrote:
> Do you reckon the unscalably large boulder is the one responsible
for
> the trifinium whirlpool at really high water?
yes yes yes
& that was one of my former whimsical tripoint guesses too
so it is good to be reminded of this
just to realize how far we have come
> The fact that your sightline runs across a flat rock is very
> intriguing because I was told by some folks at the Harper's Ferry
> outdoor store in 1998, I think, that the top of a flat rock had been
> painted to mark the trifinium some years earlier and that the paint
> was visible through several feet of water.
awesome
in 1998 they may well have been aware of & inspired by the 1997 survey
& have known full well what they were doing
whether officially or not
this sounds & looks very good
At the time of that visit
> water was VERY high and not possible to check even by boat.
However,
> a couple of years later I was there during very low water. You could
> pretty much walk across the river.
this testimony puts the question even more urgently
assuming we are looking for the mean low water line
which i do because lowest low water would leave md in far from the
full possession of the potomac it is supposed to have
still where exactly would mean low water lie
on such a broad flat river
when even small vertical differences could create large horizontal
changes in the shoreline position
how will we ever resolve this
in any event i believe your observation places even the highest
possible version of a low water line far out into the river bed
certainly hundreds of feet nne from the large boulder
& perhaps even hundreds of feet nne from the flat topped rock
I figured the trifinium to be near
> the large boulder, but checked the tops of other large rocks just in
> case. Didn't see any paint however. In any case, the paint mark
was
> an amateur work, not official.
>
> BJB
>
> --- In BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com, "acroorca2002" <orc@o...>
wrote:
> > yes indeed good point
> >
> > sometimes the subjective or even downright whimsical approach is
all
> > that is available
> > & why not
> > if this is in fact the best one can do or try or guess at any
point
> > in time
> >
> > & indeed several of us have tried this lovely mdvawv tripoint in
many
> > ways & at many times
> >
> > & it has always come down to extreme guesswork
> > til today
> > when i returned at dawn for my 7th visit
> > with the surveyors plats & detailed recovery instructions & even
pix
> > of the state line markers
> >
> > & because lots of things have changed at the busy highway
location
> > just above the tripoint since the vawv terminal markers were
> > installed there on both shoulders of the road at ground level in
1997
> > even all this exquisite detail couldnt prevent me from digging a
dry
> > hole first thru a foot of miscellaneous gravels
> > hahahahaha
> > before i actually measured rather than merely counted guardrail
posts
> > depicted in the survey diagram
> >
> > for i realized only then that a new post must have been installed
> > since 1997
> > or the draughtsman had miscounted
> > so my hole was actually one post too far west
> > hahahahaha
> > but then i did finally find the terminal mark under only a couple
of
> > inches of gravel right beside the next post to the east of this
one
> >
> >
> > so i had a point on vawv for the first time
> > yesss
> > rather than having to guess at the road seam or the usdi nps
marker
> > or the highway departments concrete prism or various other red
> > herrings
> > all of which i can now report with confidence are at least
several to
> > 35 feet into west virginia
> >
> > however
> > i still needed to find the second marker in order to determine
the
> > precise angle at which to proceed to the river
> > & tho i again measured & searched & shoveled & moved large rocks
that
> > had since fallen from the cliff
> > i still couldnt find the second marker after several hours of
trying
> > hahahahaha
> >
> > the difficulty was that all the recovery instructions were based
on
> > things that had been changed or been paved over etc since they
were
> > written
> > & the xerox of the photo wasnt suffiently readable either
> > & traffic was moving by too fast to measure things like the exact
> > distance from the road centerline etc etc
> > etc etc
> >
> > but no need to make excuses either because the survey plat showed
me
> > the correct angle i needed to proceed at was north 33 degrees east
> >
> > & i was able to project this angle from the marker with a
protractor
> > probably no less accurately than if i had recovered the companion
> > line of sight marker itself
> >
> >
> > & then
> > i actually sighted at this angle
> >
> > & beheld mdvawv for the first time
> >
> >
> > & though i couldnt tell at exactly what point on my sight line
the
> > mean low water line that determines both the mdva & mdwv vectors
of
> > this tripoint would cross the sight line
> > i knew i had the target in view on one of its crosshairs
> > & could at least now venture a really good guess as to the exact
> > tripoint position
> > rather than continue to wonder as before where in all the
vastness &
> > beauty it might actually be hanging out
> >
> > the line of sight passes right across the tops of 3 prominent
rocks
> > all protruding from the water at this time
> > first
> > between the 2 ears of a towering unscalable boulder that looks a
bit
> > like a standing bunny
> > & then
> > between the 2 ears of a much lower domelike rock
> > & finally
> > across a large flat topped rock barely visible above water
> > before advancing into a reach of open water
> > where i gauged mdvawv must lie
> > wet now
> > but on the bank in time of drought
> >
> > & of course i made my pix
> > & approached the tripoint as close as i safely could
> > & marked the marker position on the guardrail with black
electrical
> > tape
> > & the correct angle with a second loop of tape very near the first
> > so future visitors will have the same data
> >
> > just remember to look for the 2 vertical black stripes on the
> > guardrail & you will get all the rest fairly directly
> >
> > & if anyone can recover the second marker before the next drought
> > all the better
> >
> > must yield computer now
> > more later
> >
> > --- In BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com, "dcupopelilly"
> > <ronkessler@s...> wrote:
> > >
> > > I tried that point in September. For the VA-WV line, I found a
3-
> > > inch white stripe near the edge of a rock that dropped about
three
> > > feet into the river at about the spot I figured the line to be.
No
> > > idea about where this is relative to the low-water mark, but I
> > > accepted the point where the line dropped off the rock as the
tri-
> > > point (no actual marker that I could see though).
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com, "acroorca2002" <orc@o...>
> > > wrote:
> > > > tho it has just rained for 2 days here
> > > > i am still taking aim at mdvawv today
> > > > to at least examine the new alignments etc there against the
> > > blueprint
> > > > & behold for the first time the authoritative vawv terminal
> > sector
> > > as
> > > > it descends & reaches into the river toward a still unknown
mdvawv
> > > >
> > > > & no matter that the true trifinium
> > > > or low water point on that vawv line
> > > > can still only be guessed at
> > > >
> > > > my try will simply be for a truer class c look
> > > > & thus a better guess
> > > > than ever before