thanx kevin
so i can now refine my questions as follows
tho i realize they are still rather large & complicated
which tricountry points of europe are already visitable
or will become visitable in 2004
by an american tourist
without undergoing any border inspection or examination
beyond the initial scrutiny on arrival in europe
& which other tricountry points could be projected to become so
visitable by such a tourist in each ensuing year for which
projections can presently be made
& some insertions below
--- In
BoundaryPoint@yahoogroups.com, Kevin Meynell
<knm@m...> wrote:
>
> >so will this residual itsi boreder check on the itsi peoples til
2007 be
> >fairly typical among the eu25 countries or will it be fairly
exceptional
>
> Only the EU countries in the Schengen Agreement do not have
border controls
> between each other. This currently only excludes the UK and
Ireland
> (although they have their own common travel area), and
includes the EEA
> countries of Norway and Iceland.
>
> However, Schengen will not automatically apply to the ten new
EU countries,
> partly because their citizens will not have work or residence
rights in
> some of the existing EU countries for up to seven years (some
EU members
> will have no restrictions, whilst others will apply them for less
than
> maximum allowed). In addition, the EU must first be satisfied
that the
> border controls with non-EU countries are effective.
>
> >i was imagining completely open borders would be the rule
between & among
> >all 25 of these member states
>
> No, and it never was the case.
yes i realize it is not yet the case
nor ever has been
but as my above questions also seek to learn
is there a projected date yet for it to become the case
>
> >& wouldnt this residual customs &or immigration check apply
all the more
> >stringently to 3rd party peoples or yikes non eu peoples
>
> There are no custom checks between any EU countries, with
the exceptions of
> external territories that have special customs status (e.g. the
Canary
> Islands, Guernsey and Jersey). Where there are border
controls, you merely
> need to show a passport or official identity card.
do you mean they dont even look you over or profile you at all
but just assume you arent smuggling or otherwise undesirable
& they simply let you show your papers & watch you go
all essentially automatically
if so
then i would consider that to be really no inspection or
examination at all
for purposes of the above questions
>
> >but then wont they all really be one country then anyway
>
> Why not?
yes precisely
i am asking why not
& if not
or since not
then when
not exactly trying to make a usa out of it
but just wanting to understand at what point of political
integration a full blown tricountry point becomes reduced to a
mere tristate point
The EU is not really analogous to the United States, even as it
> was immediately after 1789.
>
> >then isnt the eu becoming a rather glaring & marvelous
exception to the
> >general rule that countries are defined by their actually
manned borders
>
> There were already several examples of open borders in
Europe - FRMC, CHLI
> and ITSM.
right & a few more similarly minuscule unglaring unmarvelous
exceptions to the general rule
but the present eu arrangement already represents a huge lurch
from the general rule of historical normalcy almost everywhere
or dont you really agree
& therefore an entirely new sort of puzzlement for trypointing
regards
m
>
> Regards,
>
> Kevin Meynell